Beehive Valve Springs

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Re: Beehive Valve Springs

Postby hardingfv32-1 » November 29th, 2014, 1:06 pm

sharplikestump wrote:As to any engines of mine that were torn down after winning the Runoffs, the comment I generally received was "It's nice to see one entirely legal for a change".
Thank you in advance,
Mike


What babble! How long ago did one of your engines win the Runoffs? Assuming your engine was in the second place car (final results), it was 3 seconds off the pole. Maybe you should spent time with development instead legality verification.

Brian
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Re: Beehive Valve Springs

Postby sharplikestump » November 30th, 2014, 7:14 pm

hardingfv32-1 wrote:
sharplikestump wrote:As to any engines of mine that were torn down after winning the Runoffs, the comment I generally received was "It's nice to see one entirely legal for a change".
Thank you in advance,
Mike


What babble! How long ago did one of your engines win the Runoffs? Assuming your engine was in the second place car (final results), it was 3 seconds off the pole. Maybe you should spent time with development instead legality verification.

Brian

Brian,
Did I say anything about this year? How do you even arrive at that when none of mine were torn down at Laguna? Last one was Jaques... won at Mid Ohio, as well as taking the Mark Donahue award. I'm not even saying that my engine deserved any of the credit. Jaques could have done it with yours just as easy. He was that good. What I stand by is that I was complimented on my engine being totally legal. Head of Tech was Fred Meller. Check with him. He made the same comment when Stevan Davis won with mine. Agreed.......it was a long time ago. When were yours?
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Re: Beehive Valve Springs

Postby Dietmar » November 30th, 2014, 7:42 pm

I believe we need to get back on the topic:

anyone running the beehive valve springs and if so, where did you get them.

Legalities past, present, or future can either be another topic or discussed on another site.

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Re: Beehive Valve Springs

Postby sharplikestump » December 1st, 2014, 12:53 am

Dietmar wrote:I believe we need to get back on the topic:

anyone running the beehive valve springs and if so, where did you get them.

Legalities past, present, or future can either be another topic or discussed on another site.

Dietmar


yup.
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Re: Beehive Valve Springs

Postby satterley_sr » December 1st, 2014, 8:07 pm

Look up "can of worms" in the dictionary and it would show this thread!
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Re: Beehive Valve Springs

Postby brian » December 2nd, 2014, 4:45 pm

Go the PRI web site and look for spring suppliers. There are dozens that will provide what you're looking for. Comp Cams and Engle come to mind.
The above post is for reference only and your results may vary. This post is not intended to reflect the views or opinions of SCCA and should not be considered an analysis or opinion of the rules written in the GCR.
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Re: Beehive Valve Springs

Postby satterley_sr » December 3rd, 2014, 8:08 pm

Have you tried them?
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Re: Beehive Valve Springs

Postby brian » December 5th, 2014, 12:47 am

I did some research after seeing them in print and at the PRI. I decided that they weren't applicable for vee motors. Some of the reasoning is mentioned in my first posting.

The challenge with valve trains is to maintain integrity between the parts. Valve float is a bit of a misnomer, anytime any component releases from it's relative components float takes place and the valve may not even be involved. Separation between the cam, lifters, push rods and rocker assemblies causes damage and reduces performance. If you have a radical cam profile, things only get worse. High spring rates is generally how engine builders deal with the issue. Problem is as you increase spring rates, control of the spring becomes more difficult. Oscillations, or shaking of the spring, increase exponentially and will cause failure of the spring. The bee hive shaped spring resists this negative motion.

Vee cam profiles are very mellow and our RPM is relatively low, so the spring issues are not as pronounced. Plus, many of our components like lifters and valve steps don't wear very well against high spring pressures. Hope this helps.
The above post is for reference only and your results may vary. This post is not intended to reflect the views or opinions of SCCA and should not be considered an analysis or opinion of the rules written in the GCR.
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Re: Beehive Valve Springs

Postby neilcox » December 5th, 2014, 8:11 am

^ This is why I check this forum ^

I was about to give up on formulate.org.

Thank you !
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Re: Beehive Valve Springs

Postby brian » December 5th, 2014, 3:24 pm

Forgot to mention something I like to do when adjusting valves. While not necessary every time, I remove the adjusting screw and inspect the contact tip. If you see chipping or pitting in the contact face, it's likely your getting too much float. If you are good at watching your tach, and not down shifting too soon, you may have a spring pressure issue. Depending on use, I set the springs to read from 75 to 95 lbs while resting on the seat. If the engine is going to see a lot of high rpm, like upcoming Daytona, I'll favor the higher number. You can go higher than 95 lbs.on spring pressure, but expect more wear on the valve stem and adjuster.

The adjusting screws come with a radiused tip. Often, engine builders will square off the radius to achieve max lift. As a result of creating an edge on the screw to raise lift, you'll see more wear on one point of the screw and sometimes the valve tip will be gouged a bit by this edge. I prefer not to grind the adjuster screws and use push rod length to get the lift.
The above post is for reference only and your results may vary. This post is not intended to reflect the views or opinions of SCCA and should not be considered an analysis or opinion of the rules written in the GCR.
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Re: Beehive Valve Springs

Postby satterley_sr » December 10th, 2014, 11:14 pm

Brian

thanks for the info.

Dave
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